❓ Mr Staltari questions the Minister for Education on reviewing class sizes and staffing ratios in WA public schools, citing the worst student-to-teaching staff ratio nationally. The Minister defends the government's record, highlighting increased support staff and teachers, while criticizing the opposition's data interpretation.
AnsweredQoN 336Legislative Assembly
QuestionView source ↗
Schools—Class sizes
336. Mr Liam Staltari to
the Minister for Education:
Given WA public
schools now have the worst student to teaching staff ratio in the nation and
secondary schools the second worst, will the minister commit to reviewing
maximum class sizes and staffing ratios in public schools and, if not, why not?
336. Mr Liam Staltari to
the Minister for Education:
Given WA public
schools now have the worst student to teaching staff ratio in the nation and
secondary schools the second worst, will the minister commit to reviewing
maximum class sizes and staffing ratios in public schools and, if not, why not?
AnswerView source ↗
I thank the member
for the question. I am always happy to get on my feet to talk about teachers
and how much the Cook Labor government values teachers as being the single most
important asset that we have in our school system that impacts on student outcomes.
I know that to be true, of course, because I have been in the game as a public
school teacher for 27 years.
Several members
interjected.
The Speaker: Members!
Ms Sabine Winton: I reckon we on this side of the
house probably have more classroom teachers than there are in the Liberal
opposition on the other side.
Several members
interjected.
The Speaker: Members!
Ms Sabine Winton: We know a fair bit about that. What
we do know, and I know as a classroom teacher, is that classroom sizes is an
important thing for teachers; it always has been.
Mr Shane Love: You can only put so many in a
transportable.
The Speaker: Leader of the Nationals!
Several members
interjected.
The Speaker: Members!
Ms Sabine Winton: It always has been and always will
be. But what is also critically important is how we support our teachers in the
classroom. Let us be clear on what our government has achieved since 2017,
which really makes a critical difference to the life of a teacher and their
ability to support students. What I am talking about in particular is some
4,000-plus education assistants being returned into the education system to
support, importantly, the work that classroom teachers do after ed assistants
and teachers were cut under the previous Liberal government.
I know all the nice
sleight of hands that the previous government did on reducing the number of
teachers there were in our system—just when it comes to level 3 classroom
teachers, and I was one. Level 3 classroom teachers are the category of
teachers we pay highly to remain in the classroom, and we provide them with a
day a week out of the classroom to support other teachers. By a sleight of
hand, what the opposition did was to remove that extra time for those
level 3 classroom teachers. It meant a thousand level 3 classroom
teachers, just like that, lost that day a week. That is the equivalent of 100
teachers cut from the system. I can assure members, under a Labor government,
we do not do those things. In fact, we increase the number of teachers—4,000
extra teachers in the system. I know what the member for Carine likes to do. He
likes to cherrypick tiny bits of data to suit a particular narrative he is
trying to drive, to get that 10-second grab on Facebook or to get—
Several members
interjected.
The Speaker: Members!
Ms Sabine Winton: —a newsletter.
Several members
interjected.
The Speaker: Members!
Several members
interjected.
The Speaker: Minister! Minister, please pause.
Mr Basil Zempilas interjected.
The Speaker: Leader of the Opposition!
Mrs Kirrilee Warr interjected.
The Speaker: Member for Geraldton! Thank you. You do
realise your constant interjections are putting the member for Carine's
supplementary question in jeopardy, so please stop. Minister.
Ms Sabine Winton: If the member for Carine takes the
time to read all the data available throughout the Report on Government Services , he might be
interested in some other important elements, some more important elements, that
also have an impact on the ability of teachers to do their job—that is, of
course, around the student to non-teaching staff ratio in WA public schools,
which is amongst the lowest in Australia. But that does not serve his
narrative, and so he does not use it. Can I tell the member for Carine why we
have such a low ratio when it comes to students to non-teaching staff? It is
because we have employed thousands of ed assistants, we have put school psychologists
into the system, and we continue to invest in other measures that the State
School Teachers' Union has asked for. We have honoured the enterprise
bargaining agreement with small-group tuition, complex behaviour coordinators. I
find it quite extraordinary that the other side, at the moment, wants to stand
with a union and be pro-union all of a sudden—
Mr Basil Zempilas interjected.
The Speaker: Members! Leader of the Opposition, I am
calling you for the first time.
Ms Sabine Winton: —when clearly that is not in its DNA.
for the question. I am always happy to get on my feet to talk about teachers
and how much the Cook Labor government values teachers as being the single most
important asset that we have in our school system that impacts on student outcomes.
I know that to be true, of course, because I have been in the game as a public
school teacher for 27 years.
Several members
interjected.
The Speaker: Members!
Ms Sabine Winton: I reckon we on this side of the
house probably have more classroom teachers than there are in the Liberal
opposition on the other side.
Several members
interjected.
The Speaker: Members!
Ms Sabine Winton: We know a fair bit about that. What
we do know, and I know as a classroom teacher, is that classroom sizes is an
important thing for teachers; it always has been.
Mr Shane Love: You can only put so many in a
transportable.
The Speaker: Leader of the Nationals!
Several members
interjected.
The Speaker: Members!
Ms Sabine Winton: It always has been and always will
be. But what is also critically important is how we support our teachers in the
classroom. Let us be clear on what our government has achieved since 2017,
which really makes a critical difference to the life of a teacher and their
ability to support students. What I am talking about in particular is some
4,000-plus education assistants being returned into the education system to
support, importantly, the work that classroom teachers do after ed assistants
and teachers were cut under the previous Liberal government.
I know all the nice
sleight of hands that the previous government did on reducing the number of
teachers there were in our system—just when it comes to level 3 classroom
teachers, and I was one. Level 3 classroom teachers are the category of
teachers we pay highly to remain in the classroom, and we provide them with a
day a week out of the classroom to support other teachers. By a sleight of
hand, what the opposition did was to remove that extra time for those
level 3 classroom teachers. It meant a thousand level 3 classroom
teachers, just like that, lost that day a week. That is the equivalent of 100
teachers cut from the system. I can assure members, under a Labor government,
we do not do those things. In fact, we increase the number of teachers—4,000
extra teachers in the system. I know what the member for Carine likes to do. He
likes to cherrypick tiny bits of data to suit a particular narrative he is
trying to drive, to get that 10-second grab on Facebook or to get—
Several members
interjected.
The Speaker: Members!
Ms Sabine Winton: —a newsletter.
Several members
interjected.
The Speaker: Members!
Several members
interjected.
The Speaker: Minister! Minister, please pause.
Mr Basil Zempilas interjected.
The Speaker: Leader of the Opposition!
Mrs Kirrilee Warr interjected.
The Speaker: Member for Geraldton! Thank you. You do
realise your constant interjections are putting the member for Carine's
supplementary question in jeopardy, so please stop. Minister.
Ms Sabine Winton: If the member for Carine takes the
time to read all the data available throughout the Report on Government Services , he might be
interested in some other important elements, some more important elements, that
also have an impact on the ability of teachers to do their job—that is, of
course, around the student to non-teaching staff ratio in WA public schools,
which is amongst the lowest in Australia. But that does not serve his
narrative, and so he does not use it. Can I tell the member for Carine why we
have such a low ratio when it comes to students to non-teaching staff? It is
because we have employed thousands of ed assistants, we have put school psychologists
into the system, and we continue to invest in other measures that the State
School Teachers' Union has asked for. We have honoured the enterprise
bargaining agreement with small-group tuition, complex behaviour coordinators. I
find it quite extraordinary that the other side, at the moment, wants to stand
with a union and be pro-union all of a sudden—
Mr Basil Zempilas interjected.
The Speaker: Members! Leader of the Opposition, I am
calling you for the first time.
Ms Sabine Winton: —when clearly that is not in its DNA.
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