❓ A parliamentary question regarding the Premier's handling of misconduct allegations against the Member for Ballajura, specifically concerning meetings with Mr. Minniti and the timing of the Premier's response.
AnsweredQoN 550Legislative Assembly
QuestionView source ↗
MEMBER FOR BALLAJURA - ACTION BY PREMIER
I refer to the Premier’s statement last Friday, in which he announced that the member for Ballajura’s position in his government was no longer tenable and said - Last Tuesday, Mr D’Orazio approached me in my parliamentary office and advised he had been summonsed to appear at the CCC inquiry. He said the CCC had taped conversations between himself and Mr Minniti. The Premier said also - In my view, Mr D’Orazio’s behaviour constitutes serious misconduct. Mr D’Orazio showed appalling judgement by agreeing to meet Mr Minniti and discuss his traffic problems - no matter what the outcome of those discussions. (1) Can the Premier confirm that on Tuesday, 22 August he was told that the member for Ballajura had met with Mr Minniti to discuss the issue of his parking fines? (2) Given that the Premier believed that the member for Ballajura’s decision to meet with Mr Minniti showed appalling judgment no matter what the outcome of those discussions, why did it take the Premier three more days to act on this serious misconduct and remove the member for Ballajura from his government? (3) At any stage prior to the Premier’s meeting with the member for Ballajura on Friday afternoon did the Premier discuss with the member for Ballajura his possible resignation? Mr A.J. CARPENTER
I refer to the Premier’s statement last Friday, in which he announced that the member for Ballajura’s position in his government was no longer tenable and said - Last Tuesday, Mr D’Orazio approached me in my parliamentary office and advised he had been summonsed to appear at the CCC inquiry. He said the CCC had taped conversations between himself and Mr Minniti. The Premier said also - In my view, Mr D’Orazio’s behaviour constitutes serious misconduct. Mr D’Orazio showed appalling judgement by agreeing to meet Mr Minniti and discuss his traffic problems - no matter what the outcome of those discussions. (1) Can the Premier confirm that on Tuesday, 22 August he was told that the member for Ballajura had met with Mr Minniti to discuss the issue of his parking fines? (2) Given that the Premier believed that the member for Ballajura’s decision to meet with Mr Minniti showed appalling judgment no matter what the outcome of those discussions, why did it take the Premier three more days to act on this serious misconduct and remove the member for Ballajura from his government? (3) At any stage prior to the Premier’s meeting with the member for Ballajura on Friday afternoon did the Premier discuss with the member for Ballajura his possible resignation? Mr A.J. CARPENTER
AnswerView source ↗
(1)-(3) I want to clarify one thing. The dates mentioned in the question are a bit mixed up. It was actually Tuesday, 15 August, not 22 August, when the member for Ballajura came into my office. Mr R.F. Johnson : So it was a week earlier? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes, as I explained in my press conference. When I had my press conference last week, I said “last Tuesday”. It was actually the first day that we were back in the Parliament. Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
He said the CCC had taped conversations between himself and Mr Minniti.
Mr D’Orazio showed appalling judgement by agreeing to meet Mr Minniti and discuss his traffic problems - no matter what the outcome of those discussions.
(2) Given that the Premier believed that the member for Ballajura’s decision to meet with Mr Minniti showed appalling judgment no matter what the outcome of those discussions, why did it take the Premier three more days to act on this serious misconduct and remove the member for Ballajura from his government? (3) At any stage prior to the Premier’s meeting with the member for Ballajura on Friday afternoon did the Premier discuss with the member for Ballajura his possible resignation? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: (1)-(3) I want to clarify one thing. The dates mentioned in the question are a bit mixed up. It was actually Tuesday, 15 August, not 22 August, when the member for Ballajura came into my office. Mr R.F. Johnson : So it was a week earlier? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes, as I explained in my press conference. When I had my press conference last week, I said “last Tuesday”. It was actually the first day that we were back in the Parliament. Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
(3) At any stage prior to the Premier’s meeting with the member for Ballajura on Friday afternoon did the Premier discuss with the member for Ballajura his possible resignation? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: (1)-(3) I want to clarify one thing. The dates mentioned in the question are a bit mixed up. It was actually Tuesday, 15 August, not 22 August, when the member for Ballajura came into my office. Mr R.F. Johnson : So it was a week earlier? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes, as I explained in my press conference. When I had my press conference last week, I said “last Tuesday”. It was actually the first day that we were back in the Parliament. Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: (1)-(3) I want to clarify one thing. The dates mentioned in the question are a bit mixed up. It was actually Tuesday, 15 August, not 22 August, when the member for Ballajura came into my office. Mr R.F. Johnson : So it was a week earlier? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes, as I explained in my press conference. When I had my press conference last week, I said “last Tuesday”. It was actually the first day that we were back in the Parliament. Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
(1)-(3) I want to clarify one thing. The dates mentioned in the question are a bit mixed up. It was actually Tuesday, 15 August, not 22 August, when the member for Ballajura came into my office. Mr R.F. Johnson : So it was a week earlier? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes, as I explained in my press conference. When I had my press conference last week, I said “last Tuesday”. It was actually the first day that we were back in the Parliament. Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : So it was a week earlier? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes, as I explained in my press conference. When I had my press conference last week, I said “last Tuesday”. It was actually the first day that we were back in the Parliament. Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes, as I explained in my press conference. When I had my press conference last week, I said “last Tuesday”. It was actually the first day that we were back in the Parliament. Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
He said the CCC had taped conversations between himself and Mr Minniti.
Mr D’Orazio showed appalling judgement by agreeing to meet Mr Minniti and discuss his traffic problems - no matter what the outcome of those discussions.
(2) Given that the Premier believed that the member for Ballajura’s decision to meet with Mr Minniti showed appalling judgment no matter what the outcome of those discussions, why did it take the Premier three more days to act on this serious misconduct and remove the member for Ballajura from his government? (3) At any stage prior to the Premier’s meeting with the member for Ballajura on Friday afternoon did the Premier discuss with the member for Ballajura his possible resignation? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: (1)-(3) I want to clarify one thing. The dates mentioned in the question are a bit mixed up. It was actually Tuesday, 15 August, not 22 August, when the member for Ballajura came into my office. Mr R.F. Johnson : So it was a week earlier? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes, as I explained in my press conference. When I had my press conference last week, I said “last Tuesday”. It was actually the first day that we were back in the Parliament. Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
(3) At any stage prior to the Premier’s meeting with the member for Ballajura on Friday afternoon did the Premier discuss with the member for Ballajura his possible resignation? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: (1)-(3) I want to clarify one thing. The dates mentioned in the question are a bit mixed up. It was actually Tuesday, 15 August, not 22 August, when the member for Ballajura came into my office. Mr R.F. Johnson : So it was a week earlier? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes, as I explained in my press conference. When I had my press conference last week, I said “last Tuesday”. It was actually the first day that we were back in the Parliament. Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: (1)-(3) I want to clarify one thing. The dates mentioned in the question are a bit mixed up. It was actually Tuesday, 15 August, not 22 August, when the member for Ballajura came into my office. Mr R.F. Johnson : So it was a week earlier? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes, as I explained in my press conference. When I had my press conference last week, I said “last Tuesday”. It was actually the first day that we were back in the Parliament. Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
(1)-(3) I want to clarify one thing. The dates mentioned in the question are a bit mixed up. It was actually Tuesday, 15 August, not 22 August, when the member for Ballajura came into my office. Mr R.F. Johnson : So it was a week earlier? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes, as I explained in my press conference. When I had my press conference last week, I said “last Tuesday”. It was actually the first day that we were back in the Parliament. Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : So it was a week earlier? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes, as I explained in my press conference. When I had my press conference last week, I said “last Tuesday”. It was actually the first day that we were back in the Parliament. Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes, as I explained in my press conference. When I had my press conference last week, I said “last Tuesday”. It was actually the first day that we were back in the Parliament. Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : You made this statement on Friday, but on Thursday afternoon - Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I want to point something out. This may have escaped the member’s attention, but the matter was before the Corruption and Crime Commission. The member for Ballajura had come to alert me - I think quite properly - that he had been called as a witness. He was alerting the leader of his party that he had been called as a witness. We had a brief conversation about Mr Minniti. The member for Ballajura said that he knew Mr Minniti and had met him on several occasions. In fact, I think he said he had been to his home and so on. Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : And that there were taped conversations. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes. I said in my press conference that there were taped conversations. Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : On Thursday when I asked the question you acted as though you knew nothing. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No. What I, and I believe also the member for Ballajura, were keen to avoid was a situation in which potentially we might be seen to be compromising any evidence that the member for Ballajura might give to the Corruption and Crime Commission. The conversation was brief, bearing in mind also that at that stage Mr Minniti had not given any evidence himself. Imagine the outrage that would have been sparked had the member for Ballajura and I had a lengthy discussion about the evidence that he might give to the commission. Imagine the outrage at the thought that somehow or other the two of us had got together to cook up a version of events. That is why we truncated the conversation very quickly. The member for Ballajura quite properly told me that the following week he would be called before the commission to give evidence. The member for Ballajura went to the commission and gave evidence, and we all know the subsequent events. It would have been grossly improper for the two of us to sit in my office on 15 August - or any other day - prior to his appearance in the commission and discuss his evidence in detail. It would have been outrageous. Had we done that, I would have been on my feet now defending allegations that somehow we had manufactured evidence. I do not know how the member for Hillary’s mind works. However, if he thinks the more appropriate course of action was for the two of us to sit in my office and discuss the evidence, or that I should spark public debate about evidence that had not yet been given, not only by the member for Ballajura but by Mr Minniti himself, imagine how Mr Minniti might have reacted. Imagine what he might have done with his own evidence. He had not been there yet. Do not be ridiculous, my friend. It would have been an outrage. Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : Why did it take you three days to make the decision? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It did not take me three days to make the decision. Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : Yes it did. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : When the member for Ballajura had given his evidence I called him into my office. If the member checks the parliamentary statement - Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr C.J. Barnett : When was that? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : It was Friday. If the member checks the parliamentary statement, he will find it was Friday. I said in the Parliament I would not tolerate any misconduct by any member of the government. Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : It took you two hours to work out that line, Premier, huddled in your office with the door locked. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I had to give the man - The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
The SPEAKER : Members! Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I was not sitting there listening to his evidence. I had to give the man the benefit of listening to the evidence and looking at a version of the transcript of evidence that was given to me. It would have been completely outrageous - Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr C.J. Barnett : You pretended on Thursday you knew nothing about it. You put on this phoney “What?” expression. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : The member for Cottesloe, QC for the prosecution! Thank God he is not running any of the inquiries. He would have people hanged, drawn and quartered before they had given their evidence, let alone had any opportunity to do so. Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr P.B. Watson interjected . Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Exactly. We might come to this a bit later on. Is it not amazing how the political wheel turns? One casts one’s mind back to what members opposite did when they were in government. I will get the opportunity to speak at length about this later, but does anybody remember a certain member for Wanneroo called Wayde Smith? Does anybody remember him? He was a friend of the member for Hillarys. Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : No he wasn’t. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Yes he was. He was an ally of the member for Hillarys. The member engineered Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament. Does anybody remember what happened to the member for Wanneroo, Mr Wayde Smith? He was not subject to giving evidence to a commission; he was charged with perjury. What happened to him? He sat in this Parliament as a Liberal member thereafter and won preselection. The member for Hillarys was a key player in the northern suburbs, supporting Wayde Smith’s preselection, just as he supported every other corrupt activity in his area of Wanneroo - branch stacking. The member for Hillarys did, did he not? Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : I will take great delight in answering your comments and assertions in the debate, mate. I will be very happy to do so. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Did the member support Wayde Smith’s entry into the Parliament? Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr R.F. Johnson : I had nothing to do with his entry into the Parliament. His branches were different from mine, my friend. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Mr Speaker, I have addressed the question. Yes, the member for Ballajura told me that he had been summonsed to give evidence in an open hearing about conversations he had had with a man called Minniti about assistance Mr Minniti was offering him with police contacts and so on. The conversation was short and was truncated at that point because I believed both of us understood the potential danger of going on with a lengthy conversation before the member had had a chance to give his evidence.
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