❓ Mr. Papalia questions the Minister for Corrective Services about the significant increase in the Aboriginal prison population under the current government. The Minister deflects responsibility to the Attorney General and highlights the complexity of the issue.
AnsweredQoN 495Legislative Assembly
QuestionView source ↗
ABORIGINAL
PRISON POPULATION
495. Mr P. PAPALIA to the
Minister for Corrective Services:
I refer to the fact there were 1 590 Aboriginal adults in
state prisons on 1 December 2008, which was some months after the Barnett
government took office. Yesterday, on the day the Constitution Amendment
(Recognition of Aboriginal People) Bill 2015 was second read, there were 2 214
Aboriginal adults in prison.
(1) How does
the minister explain the growth by 39 per cent of Aboriginal adults in Western
Australian prisons under his government when the state's total
population grew by only 18 per cent in that time?
(2) How does the
minister explain that during the royal commission into deaths in custody in the
1990s, Aboriginal people represented 30 per cent of the state adult prison
muster, but yesterday they made up 40 per cent?
PRISON POPULATION
495. Mr P. PAPALIA to the
Minister for Corrective Services:
I refer to the fact there were 1 590 Aboriginal adults in
state prisons on 1 December 2008, which was some months after the Barnett
government took office. Yesterday, on the day the Constitution Amendment
(Recognition of Aboriginal People) Bill 2015 was second read, there were 2 214
Aboriginal adults in prison.
(1) How does
the minister explain the growth by 39 per cent of Aboriginal adults in Western
Australian prisons under his government when the state's total
population grew by only 18 per cent in that time?
(2) How does the
minister explain that during the royal commission into deaths in custody in the
1990s, Aboriginal people represented 30 per cent of the state adult prison
muster, but yesterday they made up 40 per cent?
AnswerView source ↗
(1)–(2)
I thank the member for Warnbro for that question. I am happy to stand here all
day and talk about the number of people in prisons in Western Australia.
Unfortunately, as to why they are there, the member for Warnbro has directed
the question to the wrong minister. He should have directed that question to
the Attorney General in the upper house, because he is responsible for
government policy on determining who goes to prison.
The growth rate of the prison
system population in Western Australia for the last five years is slightly
above the state population growth rate, and, of course, that is concerning.
Mr P. Papalia : It
has doubled!
Mr J.M. FRANCIS : I
will talk about the general population first. Just cool your jets, sonny Jim!
The population has increased. A general observation of the state prison
population is that if the state population continues to grow, regardless of the
push and pull factors involved and demographics, the prison population will
also continue to grow. The government is committed to try to reduce the rate of
Aboriginal incarceration in Western Australia, because at 39 per cent or 40 per
cent, with 5 536 Aboriginal people in prison today, Aboriginal people are
grossly over-represented. The reason that anyone goes to jail—in this
circumstance, Aboriginal people—is that they have committed offences
that warrant their incarceration. That is the cold hard truth of the matter.
Mr J.R. Quigley :
What about the late Ms Dhu?
The SPEAKER :
Member for Butler, I call you to order for the first time.
Mr J.M. FRANCIS : I
will say to the member for Butler's interjection that the late Ms Dhu
was not in the custody of the Department of Corrective Services, and I think
the member might best serve his time waiting to see what the State Coroner's
report concludes on that sad situation.
We have made a lot of inroads, but these people have
committed offences. I pointed out on Tuesday that members of the Labor Party go
on about what they refer to as the overpopulation of the prison system and
state that too many people are incarcerated for fine defaults and minor
offences. I do not know the categories of offences Labor members think people
are in jail for that they should not be in jail for, but I challenge them to
come out with that answer if it is to let out fine defaulters.
Ms R. Saffioti : We
have.
Mr J.M. FRANCIS :
They have not. On any given day, less than 0.4 per cent of the prison
population—on average less than 10 people—is in jail for fine
default alone. If members opposite do not think that fine defaulters should be
incarcerated, people who absolutely refuse to cooperate with the judiciary and
the legal system to repay their debts from fines, which they can get for many
things other than parking tickets, including some very serious offences, I
encourage them to get out and say that. It would undermine the entire justice
system in Western Australia if people who refuse to pay fines were not
incarcerated.
Mr J.R. Quigley interjected.
The SPEAKER :
Member for Butler, I call you to order for the second time. I asked you to stop
screaming out.
Mr J.M. FRANCIS :
As I said yesterday, we are very proud of our record on juveniles. We have
managed to have almost record low numbers of juveniles in detention for
decades. Today, the muster at Banksia Hill Detention Centre was 143 juveniles,
which is a new low for who knows how long? That is compared with what it was
under the Labor government and over the last two decades. Of the 143 juveniles
at Banksia Hill, just over 80 per cent are Aboriginal boys—I think one
girl is there at the moment. Of 143 juveniles in detention, there are three
females and 140 males. We have come a long way to address the rate of
Aboriginal incarceration. We started with the juvenile population and we are
having some great results that we are very proud of.
I thank the member for Warnbro for that question. I am happy to stand here all
day and talk about the number of people in prisons in Western Australia.
Unfortunately, as to why they are there, the member for Warnbro has directed
the question to the wrong minister. He should have directed that question to
the Attorney General in the upper house, because he is responsible for
government policy on determining who goes to prison.
The growth rate of the prison
system population in Western Australia for the last five years is slightly
above the state population growth rate, and, of course, that is concerning.
Mr P. Papalia : It
has doubled!
Mr J.M. FRANCIS : I
will talk about the general population first. Just cool your jets, sonny Jim!
The population has increased. A general observation of the state prison
population is that if the state population continues to grow, regardless of the
push and pull factors involved and demographics, the prison population will
also continue to grow. The government is committed to try to reduce the rate of
Aboriginal incarceration in Western Australia, because at 39 per cent or 40 per
cent, with 5 536 Aboriginal people in prison today, Aboriginal people are
grossly over-represented. The reason that anyone goes to jail—in this
circumstance, Aboriginal people—is that they have committed offences
that warrant their incarceration. That is the cold hard truth of the matter.
Mr J.R. Quigley :
What about the late Ms Dhu?
The SPEAKER :
Member for Butler, I call you to order for the first time.
Mr J.M. FRANCIS : I
will say to the member for Butler's interjection that the late Ms Dhu
was not in the custody of the Department of Corrective Services, and I think
the member might best serve his time waiting to see what the State Coroner's
report concludes on that sad situation.
We have made a lot of inroads, but these people have
committed offences. I pointed out on Tuesday that members of the Labor Party go
on about what they refer to as the overpopulation of the prison system and
state that too many people are incarcerated for fine defaults and minor
offences. I do not know the categories of offences Labor members think people
are in jail for that they should not be in jail for, but I challenge them to
come out with that answer if it is to let out fine defaulters.
Ms R. Saffioti : We
have.
Mr J.M. FRANCIS :
They have not. On any given day, less than 0.4 per cent of the prison
population—on average less than 10 people—is in jail for fine
default alone. If members opposite do not think that fine defaulters should be
incarcerated, people who absolutely refuse to cooperate with the judiciary and
the legal system to repay their debts from fines, which they can get for many
things other than parking tickets, including some very serious offences, I
encourage them to get out and say that. It would undermine the entire justice
system in Western Australia if people who refuse to pay fines were not
incarcerated.
Mr J.R. Quigley interjected.
The SPEAKER :
Member for Butler, I call you to order for the second time. I asked you to stop
screaming out.
Mr J.M. FRANCIS :
As I said yesterday, we are very proud of our record on juveniles. We have
managed to have almost record low numbers of juveniles in detention for
decades. Today, the muster at Banksia Hill Detention Centre was 143 juveniles,
which is a new low for who knows how long? That is compared with what it was
under the Labor government and over the last two decades. Of the 143 juveniles
at Banksia Hill, just over 80 per cent are Aboriginal boys—I think one
girl is there at the moment. Of 143 juveniles in detention, there are three
females and 140 males. We have come a long way to address the rate of
Aboriginal incarceration. We started with the juvenile population and we are
having some great results that we are very proud of.
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