❓ Mr Brown questions the Justice Minister on the comparability of costs between public and private prisons, specifically Acacia Prison, and the existence of a cost comparison model. The Minister denies cost comparison difficulties and the need for complex models.
AnsweredQoN 778Legislative Assembly
QuestionView source ↗
(2) Is the Minister also aware that one of the matters that were discussed at the meeting concerned competition between public and private prisons? (3) Is it true, as indicated at the meeting, that the publicly stated cost per prisoner in the public system and the publicly stated cost per prisoner at Acacia Prison are not comparable? (4) Does the Minister accept that the figures that have been quoted publicly as the cost per prisoner in the private prison and the cost per prisoner in the public prisons are not comparable? (5) Does the Minister also accept that cost comparisons between the public and the private prison are difficult? (6) If not, why not? (7) Does the Minister also accept that simplistic per prisoner cost comparisons between the public and Acacia Prison are not reliable? (8) If not, why not? (9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister
AnswerView source ↗
Answered
14 November 2000
Response time
35 days
The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(3) Is it true, as indicated at the meeting, that the publicly stated cost per prisoner in the public system and the publicly stated cost per prisoner at Acacia Prison are not comparable? (4) Does the Minister accept that the figures that have been quoted publicly as the cost per prisoner in the private prison and the cost per prisoner in the public prisons are not comparable? (5) Does the Minister also accept that cost comparisons between the public and the private prison are difficult? (6) If not, why not? (7) Does the Minister also accept that simplistic per prisoner cost comparisons between the public and Acacia Prison are not reliable? (8) If not, why not? (9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(4) Does the Minister accept that the figures that have been quoted publicly as the cost per prisoner in the private prison and the cost per prisoner in the public prisons are not comparable? (5) Does the Minister also accept that cost comparisons between the public and the private prison are difficult? (6) If not, why not? (7) Does the Minister also accept that simplistic per prisoner cost comparisons between the public and Acacia Prison are not reliable? (8) If not, why not? (9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(5) Does the Minister also accept that cost comparisons between the public and the private prison are difficult? (6) If not, why not? (7) Does the Minister also accept that simplistic per prisoner cost comparisons between the public and Acacia Prison are not reliable? (8) If not, why not? (9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(6) If not, why not? (7) Does the Minister also accept that simplistic per prisoner cost comparisons between the public and Acacia Prison are not reliable? (8) If not, why not? (9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(7) Does the Minister also accept that simplistic per prisoner cost comparisons between the public and Acacia Prison are not reliable? (8) If not, why not? (9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(8) If not, why not? (9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(3) Is it true, as indicated at the meeting, that the publicly stated cost per prisoner in the public system and the publicly stated cost per prisoner at Acacia Prison are not comparable? (4) Does the Minister accept that the figures that have been quoted publicly as the cost per prisoner in the private prison and the cost per prisoner in the public prisons are not comparable? (5) Does the Minister also accept that cost comparisons between the public and the private prison are difficult? (6) If not, why not? (7) Does the Minister also accept that simplistic per prisoner cost comparisons between the public and Acacia Prison are not reliable? (8) If not, why not? (9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(4) Does the Minister accept that the figures that have been quoted publicly as the cost per prisoner in the private prison and the cost per prisoner in the public prisons are not comparable? (5) Does the Minister also accept that cost comparisons between the public and the private prison are difficult? (6) If not, why not? (7) Does the Minister also accept that simplistic per prisoner cost comparisons between the public and Acacia Prison are not reliable? (8) If not, why not? (9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(5) Does the Minister also accept that cost comparisons between the public and the private prison are difficult? (6) If not, why not? (7) Does the Minister also accept that simplistic per prisoner cost comparisons between the public and Acacia Prison are not reliable? (8) If not, why not? (9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(6) If not, why not? (7) Does the Minister also accept that simplistic per prisoner cost comparisons between the public and Acacia Prison are not reliable? (8) If not, why not? (9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(7) Does the Minister also accept that simplistic per prisoner cost comparisons between the public and Acacia Prison are not reliable? (8) If not, why not? (9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(8) If not, why not? (9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(9) Does the Ministry of Justice have a complex formula or model for calculating cost per prisoner in the public system and comparing that cost on a like for like basis with the cost per prisoner in Acacia Prison? (10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(10) If not, does the Government intend to develop a model that enables those comparisons? (11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(11) If not, why not? (12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
(12) If the Government has such a model, what are the details of this model? Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
Answered on 14 November 2000 The Minister Replied: The Minister for Justice has provided the following reply (1) Yes (2) Yes (3) No (4) No (5) No (6) Cost comparisons are not considered difficult. (7) No (8) Per prisoner cost comparisons between prisons are a reliable indicator of cost efficiency. The point being made at the meeting was that the rationale for establishing a dual public/private sector service provision model in Western Australia was not simply about operating cost savings. The dual system is also designed to provide faster, more far-reaching cultural change in prison attitudes and methods, greater innovation in prison design, technology and programs, and provide an increased stimulus to improve performance throughout the prison system. (9) No (10) No (11) Cost comparisons do not require complex formulas or models. (12) Not applicable
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