❓ A parliamentary question regarding staffing levels at Albany Regional Hospital. The Minister refutes claims of a staff exodus, citing comparable figures to previous years and attributing departures to various reasons, not solely dissatisfaction.
AnsweredQoN 634Legislative Assembly
QuestionView source ↗
ALBANY REGIONAL HOSPITAL — STAFFING
I refer to recent revelations in the Albany Advertiser that a quarter of the staff of Albany Regional Hospital have left the hospital in the past year. (1) Does the minister think it is acceptable that such a high proportion of the staff have left the hospital? (2) What actions has the minister’s department taken to respond to staff concerns? (3) What immediate action will the minister take to address those concerns? (4) Why should nursing and other clinical staff stay at the hospital when the minister’s department seems so totally uninterested in the way they are treated by the management and the hospital generally? Dr K.D. HAMES
I refer to recent revelations in the Albany Advertiser that a quarter of the staff of Albany Regional Hospital have left the hospital in the past year. (1) Does the minister think it is acceptable that such a high proportion of the staff have left the hospital? (2) What actions has the minister’s department taken to respond to staff concerns? (3) What immediate action will the minister take to address those concerns? (4) Why should nursing and other clinical staff stay at the hospital when the minister’s department seems so totally uninterested in the way they are treated by the management and the hospital generally? Dr K.D. HAMES
AnswerView source ↗
(1)-(4) I am glad the member got to ask me that question in this place. Of course, he has already asked the question of me and I have already answered it once today while we were on radio. I think there would have been a lot fewer problems in Albany if he had got on with his job in the first place and got the hospital built when it was promised. Eight years of waiting under Labor — Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
(1) Does the minister think it is acceptable that such a high proportion of the staff have left the hospital? (2) What actions has the minister’s department taken to respond to staff concerns? (3) What immediate action will the minister take to address those concerns? (4) Why should nursing and other clinical staff stay at the hospital when the minister’s department seems so totally uninterested in the way they are treated by the management and the hospital generally? Dr K.D. HAMES replied: (1)-(4) I am glad the member got to ask me that question in this place. Of course, he has already asked the question of me and I have already answered it once today while we were on radio. I think there would have been a lot fewer problems in Albany if he had got on with his job in the first place and got the hospital built when it was promised. Eight years of waiting under Labor — Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
(2) What actions has the minister’s department taken to respond to staff concerns? (3) What immediate action will the minister take to address those concerns? (4) Why should nursing and other clinical staff stay at the hospital when the minister’s department seems so totally uninterested in the way they are treated by the management and the hospital generally? Dr K.D. HAMES replied: (1)-(4) I am glad the member got to ask me that question in this place. Of course, he has already asked the question of me and I have already answered it once today while we were on radio. I think there would have been a lot fewer problems in Albany if he had got on with his job in the first place and got the hospital built when it was promised. Eight years of waiting under Labor — Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
(3) What immediate action will the minister take to address those concerns? (4) Why should nursing and other clinical staff stay at the hospital when the minister’s department seems so totally uninterested in the way they are treated by the management and the hospital generally? Dr K.D. HAMES replied: (1)-(4) I am glad the member got to ask me that question in this place. Of course, he has already asked the question of me and I have already answered it once today while we were on radio. I think there would have been a lot fewer problems in Albany if he had got on with his job in the first place and got the hospital built when it was promised. Eight years of waiting under Labor — Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
(4) Why should nursing and other clinical staff stay at the hospital when the minister’s department seems so totally uninterested in the way they are treated by the management and the hospital generally? Dr K.D. HAMES replied: (1)-(4) I am glad the member got to ask me that question in this place. Of course, he has already asked the question of me and I have already answered it once today while we were on radio. I think there would have been a lot fewer problems in Albany if he had got on with his job in the first place and got the hospital built when it was promised. Eight years of waiting under Labor — Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Dr K.D. HAMES replied: (1)-(4) I am glad the member got to ask me that question in this place. Of course, he has already asked the question of me and I have already answered it once today while we were on radio. I think there would have been a lot fewer problems in Albany if he had got on with his job in the first place and got the hospital built when it was promised. Eight years of waiting under Labor — Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
(1)-(4) I am glad the member got to ask me that question in this place. Of course, he has already asked the question of me and I have already answered it once today while we were on radio. I think there would have been a lot fewer problems in Albany if he had got on with his job in the first place and got the hospital built when it was promised. Eight years of waiting under Labor — Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
(1) Does the minister think it is acceptable that such a high proportion of the staff have left the hospital? (2) What actions has the minister’s department taken to respond to staff concerns? (3) What immediate action will the minister take to address those concerns? (4) Why should nursing and other clinical staff stay at the hospital when the minister’s department seems so totally uninterested in the way they are treated by the management and the hospital generally? Dr K.D. HAMES replied: (1)-(4) I am glad the member got to ask me that question in this place. Of course, he has already asked the question of me and I have already answered it once today while we were on radio. I think there would have been a lot fewer problems in Albany if he had got on with his job in the first place and got the hospital built when it was promised. Eight years of waiting under Labor — Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
(2) What actions has the minister’s department taken to respond to staff concerns? (3) What immediate action will the minister take to address those concerns? (4) Why should nursing and other clinical staff stay at the hospital when the minister’s department seems so totally uninterested in the way they are treated by the management and the hospital generally? Dr K.D. HAMES replied: (1)-(4) I am glad the member got to ask me that question in this place. Of course, he has already asked the question of me and I have already answered it once today while we were on radio. I think there would have been a lot fewer problems in Albany if he had got on with his job in the first place and got the hospital built when it was promised. Eight years of waiting under Labor — Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
(3) What immediate action will the minister take to address those concerns? (4) Why should nursing and other clinical staff stay at the hospital when the minister’s department seems so totally uninterested in the way they are treated by the management and the hospital generally? Dr K.D. HAMES replied: (1)-(4) I am glad the member got to ask me that question in this place. Of course, he has already asked the question of me and I have already answered it once today while we were on radio. I think there would have been a lot fewer problems in Albany if he had got on with his job in the first place and got the hospital built when it was promised. Eight years of waiting under Labor — Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
(4) Why should nursing and other clinical staff stay at the hospital when the minister’s department seems so totally uninterested in the way they are treated by the management and the hospital generally? Dr K.D. HAMES replied: (1)-(4) I am glad the member got to ask me that question in this place. Of course, he has already asked the question of me and I have already answered it once today while we were on radio. I think there would have been a lot fewer problems in Albany if he had got on with his job in the first place and got the hospital built when it was promised. Eight years of waiting under Labor — Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Dr K.D. HAMES replied: (1)-(4) I am glad the member got to ask me that question in this place. Of course, he has already asked the question of me and I have already answered it once today while we were on radio. I think there would have been a lot fewer problems in Albany if he had got on with his job in the first place and got the hospital built when it was promised. Eight years of waiting under Labor — Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
(1)-(4) I am glad the member got to ask me that question in this place. Of course, he has already asked the question of me and I have already answered it once today while we were on radio. I think there would have been a lot fewer problems in Albany if he had got on with his job in the first place and got the hospital built when it was promised. Eight years of waiting under Labor — Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Dr K.D. HAMES : — for a promised hospital and what do we see? Nothing! I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
I will get on to the specific subject of the loss of jobs. The people who have gone from that hospital—120 out of 703 employees—have not left because of dissatisfaction with the hospital; they have gone for a range of reasons. People have gone on holidays, on maternity leave, on transfer to other jobs in other hospitals—there is a whole range of reasons for those people going. Only a very small number of those people have actually left as a result of dissatisfaction with conditions at the hospital. Not only that, the numbers are about the same as when members opposite were in government. Looking at the previous year’s loss, it was 120 in the 2008 calendar year and it was 108 in the 2007 calendar year—a difference of 12 people in a year. For this calendar year so far—remember that we are now up to the end of August—there have been 61. If that is extrapolated for the full year, we would expect about the same number as members opposite had in 2007. Therefore, there has not been a great exodus of staff from that hospital; it is just not true. The member called today for an inquiry and was then asked what sort of inquiry he wanted. He said, “Well, look, I don’t know. I’m not sure what sort of inquiry we’d have; maybe we’d have a meeting of people to talk about it.” Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
The SPEAKER : Order, members! Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Mr P.B. Watson : Don’t you think it is a good idea? Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Dr K.D. HAMES : The reality is that we have been to see the member. The department and country health have been to the member asking him to give the details of these people who are so unhappy with the work, because we cannot find evidence of that. There is no increase in complaints or in reports of bullying or mistreatment; there is nothing in the record. The member’s answer was that he could not say who they were. I understand the member’s difficulty because those people have not said that that is okay, but he told me before that they were worried about their jobs. They do not need to be worried about their jobs, nor do they need to come to me. The member needs to understand that for every government department, for every — Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Mr R.H. Cook : But you’re not here! You’re in Dar es Salaam. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Dr K.D. HAMES : Is the member still criticising my trip to Tanzania? The member should be ashamed of himself for criticising that trip. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Several members interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
The SPEAKER : Order, members! Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Dr K.D. HAMES : What am I interested in? I have just been, in the last week, down in Bunbury meeting the country general practitioners — Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Mr R.H. Cook interjected. The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
The SPEAKER : Order, member for Kwinana! Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Dr K.D. HAMES : — down to Floreat today meeting general practitioners, up to the Kimberley for the suicide summit — Point of Order Mr P.B. WATSON : I have asked a question about Albany and the minister is telling me all about trips that he has had everywhere. The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
The SPEAKER : I take the member’s point of order and I urge the minister to return to the point and not to take any more interjections. Questions without Notice Resumed Dr K.D. HAMES : I would love to not have to take any interjections whatsoever from that particular member. Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
Firstly, there is no evidence of increased numbers; in fact, the numbers are about the same. Secondly, we have got no evidence, other than anecdotal evidence from the member, to say that people are not happy. But there is a clearly defined process for people who have concerns about management within their department. It does not just apply to the health department—it applies to police, it applies to community services and it applies to education. There are issues in the whole of the public sector involving people who are unhappy about bullying or mistreatment, or whatever, from people who are superior to them. There is a clearly defined process for a person to make a complaint, have the complaint heard and have it adjudicated upon. It is not the role of the minister to say, “What are you doing? This person is unhappy,” when that person has not even, and will not even, register a complaint. The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
The member says that an inquiry might allow people to come forward and have their say, but there is already a system in place that allows them to have their say. People could come to me and have their say. I would welcome them doing that and discussing those issues with them. We have issues in Albany hospital, partly because it is an old, run-down hospital. We have discussed this. We are increasing the number of residents in that hospital to try to resolve the problems that the doctors have.
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