❓ Mr. Logan questions the Minister about prison officer EBA negotiations, citing dangerous working conditions. The Minister acknowledges the officers' work, commits to negotiations, and defends the government's record on prison capacity and staffing.
AnsweredQoN 632Legislative Assembly
QuestionView source ↗
PRISON OFFICERS — ENTERPRISE BARGAINING
AGREEMENT
632. Mr F.M. LOGAN to the Minister for Corrective Services:
I draw the minister's attention to the launch of the
prison officers' enterprise bargaining agreement campaign at the
footsteps of Parliament House yesterday, and in particular to the working
conditions that prison officers face every day and the example of the shocking
assault on officer Andy Smith, who was stabbed in the throat by a prisoner with
a broken-ended sharpened toilet brush.
(1) Will the
minister agree to immediately open negotiations with the prison officers and
ensure that they are concluded well before March 2013?
(2) Will the
minister negotiate an outcome that properly recognises the dangerous work of
prison officers and the value of the service they provide to the Western
Australian community?
Several members interjected.
The SPEAKER :
Member for North West, you were not asked the question so I do not expect to
hear from you. I formally call you to order for the first time today.
AGREEMENT
632. Mr F.M. LOGAN to the Minister for Corrective Services:
I draw the minister's attention to the launch of the
prison officers' enterprise bargaining agreement campaign at the
footsteps of Parliament House yesterday, and in particular to the working
conditions that prison officers face every day and the example of the shocking
assault on officer Andy Smith, who was stabbed in the throat by a prisoner with
a broken-ended sharpened toilet brush.
(1) Will the
minister agree to immediately open negotiations with the prison officers and
ensure that they are concluded well before March 2013?
(2) Will the
minister negotiate an outcome that properly recognises the dangerous work of
prison officers and the value of the service they provide to the Western
Australian community?
Several members interjected.
The SPEAKER :
Member for North West, you were not asked the question so I do not expect to
hear from you. I formally call you to order for the first time today.
AnswerView source ↗
(1)–(2)
I thank the member for the question because we are talking about important
people who service the Western Australian community—our prison
officers. I acknowledge the prison officers in the gallery today who do a job
that is difficult in circumstances that are at times very dangerous. We do what
we can to provide the proper training for our prison officers so that they can
deal with these situations. Nonetheless, there will always be exposure of
prison officers to an element of danger because that is the nature of the
beast, particularly when dealing with human beings like those who are placed in
prison for breaching community expectations. The negotiations of the EBA will
be undertaken between the minister and the union and will follow proper
process. As the member well knows, it is due in June or July next year, and I
believe that the commencement date for negotiations is December. At the
campaign launch yesterday, I did not get an opportunity to meet Andrew but I
saw him there supported by the good people from the member's side of
the house. Unfortunately, I did not have the opportunity to speak to Andrew at
great length. I do share something with Andrew inasmuch as I know what it is
like to be attacked. I know what it is like to be stitched up in a hospital. In
fact, it happened to me five times during my time in the Kimberley. It is
something that you never forget. I am very pleased that he was supported by his
work colleagues and I am pleased they were able to resolve that situation in a
manner that was in keeping with the expectations of the community.
The fact remains that we have a
mandate on this side of the house to get the criminals off the street, and that
is what we have down. We have increased the capacity of our prisons by 2 600,
and we have increased the number of prison officers. I may have made a mistake
yesterday when I said to the house that we had increased the number of staff by
575; I was a bit wrong because in fact it was 673. Compare that figure with the
figure of the previous government who brought in 682 prison officers in eight
years. So what the previous government did in eight years, we have done in
four. That is a commitment of $744 million to keep the —
Mr F.M. Logan :
Howard Sattler was dead right about you yesterday. Why don't you just
answer the question?
The
SPEAKER : You have asked the question, member for Cockburn, and I am
hearing an answer. It might not be the answer that you or anybody else in this
place wants to hear, but at the moment the minister has the call.
Mr M.J. COWPER :
Just so I can put it in perspective for members of the house, since 2008, the
Liberal–National government has increased prison beds by 2 600. I have
here a pie chart that demonstrates the capacity that this government has
brought to our prison systems as far as beds are concerned. There is stark
contrast: we have increased the capacity by 2 600 in four years, and the
previous government did significantly less in eight years. It also highlights
the point that this government is recruiting more prison officers than was the
case under the previous government.
Mr F.M. Logan interjected.
Mr M.J. COWPER : It
is interesting that the member raised Howard Sattler's name.
Mr F.M. Logan interjected.
The SPEAKER : I do
not know whether the member for Cockburn wants to say any more; I formally call
you to order for the first time today. Member for Belmont, I do not need to
hear from you, either.
Mr M.J. COWPER : It
is interesting that the member raised the issue of Bandyup because that is an
area that needs some serious work, and it is something that we are going to be
committed to. I would be interested to see what the member's policy
will be going to the next election, because at the moment members opposite sit
on the fence and throw rocks.
Mr F.M. Logan :
What have you done? You have been in power for four years!
The SPEAKER :
Member for Cockburn, I hope you want to stay in here to hear the end of the
answer, and to be here to be able to ask a supplementary question. You are not
going the right way about it. It is not an opportunity to continue yelling at
the minister. I formally call you to order for the second time today, and I do
not need contributions from anybody else, either—and that includes you,
Minister for Housing.
Mr M.J. COWPER : It
is interesting, because yesterday I heard the Prison Officers' Union
say there was an attrition rate of something like 10 people a month on average.
I examined that and the attrition rate, or the natural rise and fall, has come
back to closer to six or seven. I thought I would do a bit of research in that
area so we could get an understanding of where we are at with prison numbers. I
have another graph here. I might have copped an affliction of using graphs from
the Treasurer! We set the bar with the attrition rate at 10. We can see from
the graph we have, on average, recruited about 14 people a month compared with
what the previous Labor government did over eight years. As members can see,
here is the attrition rate and the rate of recruitment under this government
compared with that of the Labor government in its eight years. The previous
government did not even keep track with the attrition rate. It was going
backwards. At least we are on the right side of the ledger, and that is
something I am very proud of given we have a situation.
With respect to the negotiations, this government will treat
our prison officers with respect. We will sit down at the appropriate time and
negotiate, as was the case in 2010. If members recall, an agreement went
virtually unheralded in the media. The minister at the time, I think, was the
member for Bateman and that agreement was negotiated, from memory at about 3.5
per cent, member for Bateman? That did not get much attention in the media.
Mr P. Papalia : I
don't think he's going to help you.
Mr M.J. COWPER : We
will apply the same principle and treat them fairly and negotiate in good
faith.
I thank the member for the question because we are talking about important
people who service the Western Australian community—our prison
officers. I acknowledge the prison officers in the gallery today who do a job
that is difficult in circumstances that are at times very dangerous. We do what
we can to provide the proper training for our prison officers so that they can
deal with these situations. Nonetheless, there will always be exposure of
prison officers to an element of danger because that is the nature of the
beast, particularly when dealing with human beings like those who are placed in
prison for breaching community expectations. The negotiations of the EBA will
be undertaken between the minister and the union and will follow proper
process. As the member well knows, it is due in June or July next year, and I
believe that the commencement date for negotiations is December. At the
campaign launch yesterday, I did not get an opportunity to meet Andrew but I
saw him there supported by the good people from the member's side of
the house. Unfortunately, I did not have the opportunity to speak to Andrew at
great length. I do share something with Andrew inasmuch as I know what it is
like to be attacked. I know what it is like to be stitched up in a hospital. In
fact, it happened to me five times during my time in the Kimberley. It is
something that you never forget. I am very pleased that he was supported by his
work colleagues and I am pleased they were able to resolve that situation in a
manner that was in keeping with the expectations of the community.
The fact remains that we have a
mandate on this side of the house to get the criminals off the street, and that
is what we have down. We have increased the capacity of our prisons by 2 600,
and we have increased the number of prison officers. I may have made a mistake
yesterday when I said to the house that we had increased the number of staff by
575; I was a bit wrong because in fact it was 673. Compare that figure with the
figure of the previous government who brought in 682 prison officers in eight
years. So what the previous government did in eight years, we have done in
four. That is a commitment of $744 million to keep the —
Mr F.M. Logan :
Howard Sattler was dead right about you yesterday. Why don't you just
answer the question?
The
SPEAKER : You have asked the question, member for Cockburn, and I am
hearing an answer. It might not be the answer that you or anybody else in this
place wants to hear, but at the moment the minister has the call.
Mr M.J. COWPER :
Just so I can put it in perspective for members of the house, since 2008, the
Liberal–National government has increased prison beds by 2 600. I have
here a pie chart that demonstrates the capacity that this government has
brought to our prison systems as far as beds are concerned. There is stark
contrast: we have increased the capacity by 2 600 in four years, and the
previous government did significantly less in eight years. It also highlights
the point that this government is recruiting more prison officers than was the
case under the previous government.
Mr F.M. Logan interjected.
Mr M.J. COWPER : It
is interesting that the member raised Howard Sattler's name.
Mr F.M. Logan interjected.
The SPEAKER : I do
not know whether the member for Cockburn wants to say any more; I formally call
you to order for the first time today. Member for Belmont, I do not need to
hear from you, either.
Mr M.J. COWPER : It
is interesting that the member raised the issue of Bandyup because that is an
area that needs some serious work, and it is something that we are going to be
committed to. I would be interested to see what the member's policy
will be going to the next election, because at the moment members opposite sit
on the fence and throw rocks.
Mr F.M. Logan :
What have you done? You have been in power for four years!
The SPEAKER :
Member for Cockburn, I hope you want to stay in here to hear the end of the
answer, and to be here to be able to ask a supplementary question. You are not
going the right way about it. It is not an opportunity to continue yelling at
the minister. I formally call you to order for the second time today, and I do
not need contributions from anybody else, either—and that includes you,
Minister for Housing.
Mr M.J. COWPER : It
is interesting, because yesterday I heard the Prison Officers' Union
say there was an attrition rate of something like 10 people a month on average.
I examined that and the attrition rate, or the natural rise and fall, has come
back to closer to six or seven. I thought I would do a bit of research in that
area so we could get an understanding of where we are at with prison numbers. I
have another graph here. I might have copped an affliction of using graphs from
the Treasurer! We set the bar with the attrition rate at 10. We can see from
the graph we have, on average, recruited about 14 people a month compared with
what the previous Labor government did over eight years. As members can see,
here is the attrition rate and the rate of recruitment under this government
compared with that of the Labor government in its eight years. The previous
government did not even keep track with the attrition rate. It was going
backwards. At least we are on the right side of the ledger, and that is
something I am very proud of given we have a situation.
With respect to the negotiations, this government will treat
our prison officers with respect. We will sit down at the appropriate time and
negotiate, as was the case in 2010. If members recall, an agreement went
virtually unheralded in the media. The minister at the time, I think, was the
member for Bateman and that agreement was negotiated, from memory at about 3.5
per cent, member for Bateman? That did not get much attention in the media.
Mr P. Papalia : I
don't think he's going to help you.
Mr M.J. COWPER : We
will apply the same principle and treat them fairly and negotiate in good
faith.
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