❓ A parliamentary question regarding the potential implementation of a card-based alcohol purchasing system in the Kimberley region of WA, similar to that in the NT. The Minister responds that the government has decided against it, citing limitations and costs.
AnsweredQoN 278Legislative Assembly
QuestionView source ↗
KIMBERLEY — ALCOHOL MANAGEMENT PLAN
The introduction of a card-based alcohol purchasing system similar to that operating in the Northern Territory towns of Alice Springs and Katherine has been put forward as an option for dealing with alcohol abuse issues in the Kimberley. I understand that the government has completed an assessment of the Northern Territory system and has reached a decision on whether a similar system is appropriate for Western Australia. Could the minister please inform the house as to the detail of the decision? Mr W.J. Johnston interjected. The SPEAKER : Member for Cannington, when you are asked questions I expect that you like to able to answer them. The Minister for Racing and Gaming is being asked a question. Mr W.J. Johnston interjected. The SPEAKER : I formally call the member for Cannington to order for the third time today. Mr T.K. WALDRON
The introduction of a card-based alcohol purchasing system similar to that operating in the Northern Territory towns of Alice Springs and Katherine has been put forward as an option for dealing with alcohol abuse issues in the Kimberley. I understand that the government has completed an assessment of the Northern Territory system and has reached a decision on whether a similar system is appropriate for Western Australia. Could the minister please inform the house as to the detail of the decision? Mr W.J. Johnston interjected. The SPEAKER : Member for Cannington, when you are asked questions I expect that you like to able to answer them. The Minister for Racing and Gaming is being asked a question. Mr W.J. Johnston interjected. The SPEAKER : I formally call the member for Cannington to order for the third time today. Mr T.K. WALDRON
AnswerView source ↗
I thank the member for Geraldton for the question. I can tell members that the government’s view is that a card-based system is not considered appropriate in Western Australia, but that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I want to go over why we came to that decision. People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
Mr W.J. Johnston interjected. The SPEAKER : Member for Cannington, when you are asked questions I expect that you like to able to answer them. The Minister for Racing and Gaming is being asked a question. Mr W.J. Johnston interjected. The SPEAKER : I formally call the member for Cannington to order for the third time today. Mr T.K. WALDRON replied: I thank the member for Geraldton for the question. I can tell members that the government’s view is that a card-based system is not considered appropriate in Western Australia, but that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I want to go over why we came to that decision. People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
The SPEAKER : Member for Cannington, when you are asked questions I expect that you like to able to answer them. The Minister for Racing and Gaming is being asked a question. Mr W.J. Johnston interjected. The SPEAKER : I formally call the member for Cannington to order for the third time today. Mr T.K. WALDRON replied: I thank the member for Geraldton for the question. I can tell members that the government’s view is that a card-based system is not considered appropriate in Western Australia, but that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I want to go over why we came to that decision. People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
Mr W.J. Johnston interjected. The SPEAKER : I formally call the member for Cannington to order for the third time today. Mr T.K. WALDRON replied: I thank the member for Geraldton for the question. I can tell members that the government’s view is that a card-based system is not considered appropriate in Western Australia, but that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I want to go over why we came to that decision. People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
The SPEAKER : I formally call the member for Cannington to order for the third time today. Mr T.K. WALDRON replied: I thank the member for Geraldton for the question. I can tell members that the government’s view is that a card-based system is not considered appropriate in Western Australia, but that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I want to go over why we came to that decision. People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
Mr T.K. WALDRON replied: I thank the member for Geraldton for the question. I can tell members that the government’s view is that a card-based system is not considered appropriate in Western Australia, but that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I want to go over why we came to that decision. People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
I thank the member for Geraldton for the question. I can tell members that the government’s view is that a card-based system is not considered appropriate in Western Australia, but that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I want to go over why we came to that decision. People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
Mr W.J. Johnston interjected. The SPEAKER : Member for Cannington, when you are asked questions I expect that you like to able to answer them. The Minister for Racing and Gaming is being asked a question. Mr W.J. Johnston interjected. The SPEAKER : I formally call the member for Cannington to order for the third time today. Mr T.K. WALDRON replied: I thank the member for Geraldton for the question. I can tell members that the government’s view is that a card-based system is not considered appropriate in Western Australia, but that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I want to go over why we came to that decision. People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
The SPEAKER : Member for Cannington, when you are asked questions I expect that you like to able to answer them. The Minister for Racing and Gaming is being asked a question. Mr W.J. Johnston interjected. The SPEAKER : I formally call the member for Cannington to order for the third time today. Mr T.K. WALDRON replied: I thank the member for Geraldton for the question. I can tell members that the government’s view is that a card-based system is not considered appropriate in Western Australia, but that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I want to go over why we came to that decision. People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
Mr W.J. Johnston interjected. The SPEAKER : I formally call the member for Cannington to order for the third time today. Mr T.K. WALDRON replied: I thank the member for Geraldton for the question. I can tell members that the government’s view is that a card-based system is not considered appropriate in Western Australia, but that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I want to go over why we came to that decision. People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
The SPEAKER : I formally call the member for Cannington to order for the third time today. Mr T.K. WALDRON replied: I thank the member for Geraldton for the question. I can tell members that the government’s view is that a card-based system is not considered appropriate in Western Australia, but that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I want to go over why we came to that decision. People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
Mr T.K. WALDRON replied: I thank the member for Geraldton for the question. I can tell members that the government’s view is that a card-based system is not considered appropriate in Western Australia, but that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I want to go over why we came to that decision. People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
I thank the member for Geraldton for the question. I can tell members that the government’s view is that a card-based system is not considered appropriate in Western Australia, but that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I want to go over why we came to that decision. People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
People misunderstand what the so-called alcohol card really is. Some people think that it is simply a card that completely targets problem drinkers and will replace alcohol restrictions. The conclusion that we have reached, through my visits to the Northern Territory and the department’s assessment, is that it is quite evident that that is not the case. An alcohol court has been established in the Northern Territory system. They had to change a lot of legislation and it took some years to get to that situation. A person has to commit a crime involving alcohol to go to the alcohol court. The court may ban an offender from purchasing alcohol. Point of sale scanning equipment is installed at licensed premises and people have to produce identification when they purchase alcohol. If the scanning equipment comes up saying that the person is banned, that person is not sold alcohol. There are 400 people in Alice Springs and Katherine who are on the banned drink register. I have been to Alice Springs twice to look at this closely, on occasions about a year or so part. I met with police, licensees and the alcohol authorities over there and I had the department complete an assessment. The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
The assessment has been considered by cabinet and we consider that the card-based system is not appropriate. There are a number of reasons, which I will go through. The system does not target the alcohol problem drinkers per se, but only those who have been convicted of an alcohol-related crime. If someone is causing a bit of trouble, we cannot simply ban them. The offender has to commit a crime, be charged, go to court, be convicted and be banned from alcohol by the judge. A lot of steps are involved before an offender is banned. One of the biggest issues is secondary supply. Banned people in the Northern Territory are still gaining access to alcohol. The police in Alice Springs have made it very clear to me that they are continually picking up people who have been banned from alcohol but are in a bad state. One of the other issues is ID. People produce their driver’s licence or passport at the point of sale. Many Aboriginal people in the Northern Territory—it may not be to the same proportion in the Kimberley—do not have ID, a driver’s licence, passport or birth certificate. I think the Northern Territory took two years to develop a system with a card. To its credit it has done that and I congratulate it for that. However, if we are to go down that track, there is a big issue. The Northern Territory is having some issues with those cards. I do not have time to go through that. Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
Mr M.P. Murray : Do you think that one carton of full-strength and one bottle of scotch every day from each pub in Kununurra is fair under your system? Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
Mr T.K. WALDRON : I will talk to the member about that later. It is a whole different thing with the card. The card does not address that. I will come back to that in a minute. It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
It is a costly exercise and some of the locals and tourists obviously find it a bit of an impost, although I think most people have become used to using their cards. Probably the most important point is that the alcohol statistics from the Northern Territory indicate that there is little or no reduction in alcohol abuse since the introduction of the card. The card is not combating that side of the problem and it takes a long time to legislate et cetera. I think the measures that we have in place with the restrictions et cetera are doing a pretty good job. We need to keep monitoring that. Those measures are becoming effective and we have shown we have better outcomes here than those in the Northern Territory. As I said at the start, people think that the card replaces restrictions. The card has real value because it works well with the restrictions. A person in Alice Springs can get only one cask a day and once they have bought it that cask is on their card and they cannot go and buy two. We could introduce the system here, but, once again, secondary supply is an issue. It helps, but it is still not the be-all and end-all because the secondary supply still happens even in that situation. The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
The clear outcome of the assessment is that a card-based system is unlikely to target the problem drinkers or work without having those broad-based restrictions also in place. At the moment we are certainly achieving better results than the Northern Territory. Therefore, it is our intention to stay with the current measures. However, that is not to say that circumstances will not change in the future. I will continue to monitor the progress with the card-based system, particularly if we can find a solution to the secondary supply problem. The Northern Territory has not found that solution and I do not think we have. I am happy to keep monitoring the card-based system. The government will keep monitoring that system. After going through the whole process, the outcomes do not warrant the card-based system at this stage.
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