❓ Opposition asks the Premier about claims of gas companies profiteering during a gas crisis, referencing comments by Don Voelte. The Premier acknowledges the concern, refers to ACCC oversight, and defends industry cooperation.
AnsweredQoN 309Legislative Assembly
QuestionView source ↗
APACHE ENERGY GAS PLANT EXPLOSION — COMPANIES EXPLOITING GAS CRISIS
Mr Don Voelte is reported in today’s The West Australian as claiming that some Western Australian companies may be exploiting the gas crisis by onselling some of their quota at hugely inflated prices. (1) Does the Premier stand by his warning of 11 June that cooperation on the crisis will “start to fall apart because people are being encouraged to start pointing the finger and blaming someone, or because people are being accused of things like price gouging or profiteering”? (2) Does the Premier now intend to lecture Mr Voelte about or discuss with him his remarks? (3) Will the Premier take seriously these claims of profiteering made by Mr Voelte? (4) If so, what will the Premier do to prevent profiteering and protect Western Australian businesses? Mr A.J. CARPENTER
Mr Don Voelte is reported in today’s The West Australian as claiming that some Western Australian companies may be exploiting the gas crisis by onselling some of their quota at hugely inflated prices. (1) Does the Premier stand by his warning of 11 June that cooperation on the crisis will “start to fall apart because people are being encouraged to start pointing the finger and blaming someone, or because people are being accused of things like price gouging or profiteering”? (2) Does the Premier now intend to lecture Mr Voelte about or discuss with him his remarks? (3) Will the Premier take seriously these claims of profiteering made by Mr Voelte? (4) If so, what will the Premier do to prevent profiteering and protect Western Australian businesses? Mr A.J. CARPENTER
AnswerView source ↗
I thank the member for the question. (1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
(1) Does the Premier stand by his warning of 11 June that cooperation on the crisis will “start to fall apart because people are being encouraged to start pointing the finger and blaming someone, or because people are being accused of things like price gouging or profiteering”? (2) Does the Premier now intend to lecture Mr Voelte about or discuss with him his remarks? (3) Will the Premier take seriously these claims of profiteering made by Mr Voelte? (4) If so, what will the Premier do to prevent profiteering and protect Western Australian businesses? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: I thank the member for the question. (1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
(2) Does the Premier now intend to lecture Mr Voelte about or discuss with him his remarks? (3) Will the Premier take seriously these claims of profiteering made by Mr Voelte? (4) If so, what will the Premier do to prevent profiteering and protect Western Australian businesses? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: I thank the member for the question. (1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
(3) Will the Premier take seriously these claims of profiteering made by Mr Voelte? (4) If so, what will the Premier do to prevent profiteering and protect Western Australian businesses? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: I thank the member for the question. (1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
(4) If so, what will the Premier do to prevent profiteering and protect Western Australian businesses? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: I thank the member for the question. (1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: I thank the member for the question. (1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
I thank the member for the question. (1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
(1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
(1) Does the Premier stand by his warning of 11 June that cooperation on the crisis will “start to fall apart because people are being encouraged to start pointing the finger and blaming someone, or because people are being accused of things like price gouging or profiteering”? (2) Does the Premier now intend to lecture Mr Voelte about or discuss with him his remarks? (3) Will the Premier take seriously these claims of profiteering made by Mr Voelte? (4) If so, what will the Premier do to prevent profiteering and protect Western Australian businesses? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: I thank the member for the question. (1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
(2) Does the Premier now intend to lecture Mr Voelte about or discuss with him his remarks? (3) Will the Premier take seriously these claims of profiteering made by Mr Voelte? (4) If so, what will the Premier do to prevent profiteering and protect Western Australian businesses? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: I thank the member for the question. (1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
(3) Will the Premier take seriously these claims of profiteering made by Mr Voelte? (4) If so, what will the Premier do to prevent profiteering and protect Western Australian businesses? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: I thank the member for the question. (1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
(4) If so, what will the Premier do to prevent profiteering and protect Western Australian businesses? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: I thank the member for the question. (1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: I thank the member for the question. (1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
I thank the member for the question. (1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
(1)-(4) May I say at the outset that I think the member made a very good point on Friday, it might have been, or yesterday — Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
Mr T. Buswell : Sunday. I had been umpiring junior football. Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : Sunday—about the prospect of price gouging or profiteering and the attention of the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission. I echo that sentiment. In fact, the ACCC has been alerted to this as-yet, I think, hypothetical scenario, and I think that is the appropriate mechanism by which these things should be addressed. Therefore, I think the Leader of the Opposition made a good suggestion, and it was a suggestion that I concurred with. I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
I had a very good meeting with Mr Voelte on Friday and discussed this issue and all the different elements of it. He was at pains to assure me, Leader of the Opposition, that Woodside and the North West Shelf would not in any way, shape or form be engaged in profiteering and that they would take a dim view, as would we all, I think, of any party that was engaged in profiteering. I have not spoken to him subsequently, and I have not been apprised of the genesis of those remarks, but I suspect that what has happened is that the hypothetical scenarios or potential scenarios or rumours about this issue have — Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
Mr T. Buswell : Premier, when you say “hypothetical”, are you assuming it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : I am assuming that it is not happening. Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
Mr T. Buswell : Do you know it’s not happening? Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
Mr A.J. CARPENTER : No, I do not know, but I am assuming. None of us knows, I do not think—we would not want to stake our lives on it. However, as the Leader of the Opposition said, the ACCC has a very powerful investigative capacity, and if that is going on, or if that happens prospectively, the ACCC should be the body that deals with it. In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
In relation to the genesis of his remarks, I suspect that that possibility was put to Mr Voelte—that is, as it has been put to me, that profiteering may be occurring—and that he responded in the way he did as a result of that. No evidence, Leader of the Opposition, has been put to me to suggest that it is happening. I am aware, and I think we are all aware, that some energy consumers that have been unable to access their normal energy supplies have been offered electricity or gas at higher prices than they would normally have paid. What we have to remember—I think that this may well be the basis for some of this commentary—is that if diesel is used to replace gas-fired energy, the price of that energy is going to be very substantially higher than the gas-fired energy or gas contracts that were in place previously. Diesel is a much more expensive fuel, costing roughly five to 10 times the price that would have been in place before the incident at Varanus Island. That is the basis upon which people may have been making speculative judgements about profiteering or price gouging. I reiterate that the cooperation the state government has had from all players in this matter has been extraordinary. It says something very positive about our business community. As late as yesterday, for example, the Property Council of Australia, after a discussion with the Minister for Energy, called a meeting of its members to voluntarily work out regimes under which they could reduce energy consumption. I congratulate members of the Property Council on that initiative. Joe Lenzo, on behalf of the Property Council, has done a tremendous service to the state. That is typical of the reaction I have seen so far. In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
In relation to the other point about finger pointing and blaming, it is human nature to speculate about the cause and effect of situations, particularly situations as serious as this. However, it would be very unhelpful, unfortunate and unwise if, in the absence of any evidence, accusations were made about profiteering, price gouging or improper conduct, when it may well be that no such conduct has taken place. It would be a tragedy if those sorts of unwarranted attacks started to circulate. I have, for example, urged everybody to wait until we have absolute clarity of information about the initial cause of the incident before we start leaping to judgement about why it happened and how it may or may not have been prevented. I urge the same caution in relation to this aspect.
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